the plot thickens... random ancestry crap

[arethinn]

My mother sez:

[My great-great-great-grandfather and -mother] were here more than likely before 1845 or around 1845 your [great-great-grandfather] was born Dec 1851 Luke

Thomas wife Elizabeth I don't have exact birthdates; death dates or marriage dates, which of course makes for a real problem with such a common name

What I have been able to find out was from the 1880 census records for Lockport NY

and at that time he was 66 years old he was born in Ireland, wife Elizabeth age 69 born in Ireland his occupation was works in a quarry

son Michael was living with them at the time of the census age was 35 he was single a laborer and was born in Canada

Also son Luke age 31 born NY occupation stave joiner [this date doesn't seem to add up - if he was born in 1851, then he can't have been 31 in 1880, but then my father says his great-grandfather Luke's birthdate was always in question and that he himself claimed it was 1849, which would add up]

so possibly they had immigrated in 1845 first to Canada then NY.

---

So not only did I have several generations of blood back there in that area of the continent before someone moved to Ohio and then my father's family moved to California in the 1950s, but it turns out they may actually have lived specifically in Canada first? It boggles the mind. Six generations to come full circle eh? *chuckles* 'Course I'm told it takes seven generations in the same place for the relationship between people and land to develop, so no wonder so many Americans are "rootless", since lots of us don't have that many even in the country, never mind in the same few tens of square miles.

I just find it amusing that it's the place my paternal line first lived here, and now my life is (hopefully) leading me back there. On the other hand, my mother was born here in California, but I don't know where that leads past her own mother, since she was adopted. It would be interesting if that side was all Californians back to the same period of time... 1848-1849? lol! illuviel and ahril - more "gold" for ya? And re: red and gold.. why, those are the, ahem, 49ers' colours, of course. Not that I care, but my mother is pretty religious about 49ers football. What a bizarre constellation of meaningless meaning this is.

I always figured that if I have "it", I got it from my paternal line because that's where the reasonably pure Irish stuff is (I think my paternal grandmother is German stock, but I don't know, and I don't know anything about any of the other wives on up the line except for the aforementioned Elizabeth 3-greats grandmother, who was obviously Irish, and whose name my own most resembles, although my mother's middle name is also Elizabeth), but on the other hand, they're all brown hair and blue eyes and I appear to have gotten my colouring mostly from my mother.

But then again again, I don't know what my grandfather looked like when he was younger; I've been comparing myself to the other living people of my paternal line and in that context I do come up kind of "changelingish" due to my mother's genetics. But maybe I wouldn't look too different from further paternal ancestors, or other maternal ancestors. I don't know. (I do know that I don't fit into the "greater sensitivity and greater health problems" crowd.)

And then of course there's the fact that neither of my parents "has it", I mean, manifesting it in any sense, so either it's not there or you can be a carrier like you can with sickle-cell anemia or something...

Comments

[starlightforest.livejournal.com]

Well, my paternal grandmother's maiden name was Powell, which is apparently Welsh, but that only means that her father (or father's father, etc) was possibly of Welsh extraction; I have no idea about her mother. I'll have to take a look at my mother's genealogy file on all this.

When I say neither of my parents seems to show a glimmer I mean it. My father is rational to a fault. My mother claims to believe in some sort of vague "Native American" "great spirit" type of thing, but she was a Catholic when she was younger and before that a Baptist (she tried unsuccessfully to get my a-religious father into Catholicism), and in any case is quite conservative in thought and deed without any "woo woo" about her that I know of.

[ahril.livejournal.com]

1. HA! The German might do it if the Irish doesn't. Dan has told me that usually, somwhere in the mix, the vast majority od Elves have German in their ancestry. It is true of me also, though a very small percentage through one of my great-grandmothers on my mother's side.

from An Interview with Nicholas de Vere (http://www.dagobertsrevenge.com/devere/interview1.html):

"TT: How did the Dragon race begin, and how did they become a separate race from the rest of humanity?

NDV: They didn’t originate from outer space, that’s for sure. A principal element of the Dragon genome originated in the vast forests of central Europe, and cut off from other species, they developed as a distinct race. By the time of the Anunnaki they had been hybridised to form the ancestors of the later Elves or Dragon kings and queens."

2. Neither of my parents manifests it either, but there are subtle hints that they have it. For instance, my father has told me he can see auras, and my mother casts spells when she's cooking. She calls it "putting prayer into the food". She is Christian, but the formulae are exactly the same as any Witch might use.

The one other of my parents' generation who I KNOW has it is my father's first cousin. She has the recessive blue eyes and fair hair and the hemoglobin anomaly that I do. Her mother and my paternal grandmmother were sisters. They both, and their mother, my great-grandmother Sophia, all had it. Sophia was a Waller, descended from Alured de Valer whose name means "Elf Counsel from the Valley".

[starlightforest.livejournal.com]

*blinks* I guess you were deleting the other comment because of the HTML error while I was posting the reply? I'll paste here in case the other one doesn't send you a notification.

Well, my paternal grandmother's maiden name was Powell, which is apparently Welsh, but that only means that her father (or father's father, etc) was possibly of Welsh extraction; I have no idea about her mother. I'll have to take a look at my mother's genealogy file on all this.

When I say neither of my parents seems to show a glimmer I mean it. My father is rational to a fault. My mother claims to believe in some sort of vague "Native American" "great spirit" type of thing, but she was a Catholic when she was younger and before that a Baptist (she tried unsuccessfully to get my a-religious father into Catholicism), and in any case is quite conservative in thought and deed without any "woo woo" about her that I know of.

[ahril.livejournal.com]

Yes, sorry. It was late and I fubared my code, so I fixed it.

[starlightforest.livejournal.com]

All the Campbell stuff is kind of interesting, but even if the two big IFs are true (IF these are Irish MacCathmhaoils and not Scottish Campbells; IF the semi-mythical genealogies are correct), that bloodline is still Milesian, not Tuatha. I have no idea where I would find information on clan/sept/family/whatever legends of connections to "other" blood.

Amusingly, on my adoptive paternal grandfather's side, way back in England in the 1500s sometime there is a "Faye", but it's her given name, not her surname. On the other hand, her last name is "Nelson" - which can be "Niall's son", so we're back to Niall again. However I am never sure how much importance to lay on my adoptive family. Certainly in terms of spiritual ancestry it is important (fostering was one of the Celts' big things, after all), and it's the only paternal line my mother knows anything about at all. But if we are talking something that would be transmitted genetically, then...

[starlightforest.livejournal.com]

The German thread (my grandmother's maternal grandmother, I think, was a German immigrant, so it goes back from there into Bavaria in that section of the tree) appears to be quite dwarfed by the stuff from the Isles, mostly English and Welsh, but also:

To my surprise, a documented Irish thread from my mother's blood-maternal side as well as what I knew about from my father's side. It is also speculated in her adoption papers that her natural father was Irish, but it only says "blond and blue eyed, age 22 at birth of child" and that's all we know about him. He was not the man her mother was married to.

If the general websites are right about where names are common in Ireland, it appears both come from places in Ulster province, which indicates likely admixture of Scots lineage (and indeed my natural maternal grandmother's ethnicity is specified in the same adoption papers as "Scots Irish", but I'm not sure if this was a self-identification, or what).

Bizarre: The Irish thread on that side that I spoke of is named Campbell. It seems that if this is actually Irish and not Scottish, it is an anglicized version of MacCathmhaoil, which is a sept that claims descent from Niall of the Nine Hostages. O.o This name apparently is from County Tyrone, which is in Ulster, so I suppose it's not impossible, although my natural grandmother's claim to be Scots-Irish says to me that that's what she was told she was, which would point to Scottish origin rather than native Irish origin. No clue tho.

[starlightforest.livejournal.com]

Err, got caught up in the Campbell thing and forgot to actually get to my point, which was: I certainly seem to have all my bases covered, don't I? lol.

[gothikfaerie.livejournal.com]

*makes Spock eyebrow* fascinating.

My parents are both pretty dormant as well, altho with, as i've said, moderately bohemian tendencies; and they're pretty relaxed about a lot of things - but i'm not going to float this one by them, not this late in the game. However, my brother and i both have 'it' - he's even got pointy ears, and looks rather like Bowie looks these days ('nuff said, eh? ;) Tho we haven't discussed it formally, i don't think he'd be too put off if i brought it up.

i never thought i had much Irish in me; i grew up thinking i was primarily Scots and German. Then i started looking in to genealogy and discovered the 'German' is likely either Belgian or Norman French Huguenot. As for any Irish.. it's difficult to know, having a grandmother who was born out of wedlock. i only last night learned that the last name on her birth certificate may NOT be the name i've thought it was all my life. And with her father possibly named 'Sherman' - who knows. i can only trace the Scotts and the MacDonalds with any accuracy. Tho curiously, i'm remembering that once upona, magpie_menace and i Wondered over possibly mutual MacDonald ancestry, and wouldn't that be a hoot? Of course, try tracking a Donald or Angus MacDonald in Nova Scotia. Might as well be John Smith ;p